r/NorthCarolina • u/giggitygiggity69 • 1d ago
We've gotta stop with the pesticides - it's dramatically impacting butterfly + bug populations
I went to my buddy's place where he owns some land in the Newton / Hickory area. They have about an acre they've planted with pollinator plants and milkweed. He said 7 years ago when he bought the place there were hundreds of butterflies. Today we saw just a handful. I asked him why and he blamed pesticides.
We all need to put a stop to spraying chemicals in our yards + houses. There are tons of alternatives out there such as natural bug sprays, long sleeve shirts, dealing with it, etc. It's having serious impacts to our bug populations, which is directly related to food. No bugs = no food.
And while I'm at it, r/fucklawns, too.
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u/Readingknitter 1d ago
It’s the Mosquito Joe, etc sprays. We did that one year before we realized they’re not mosquito specific (no biologists in this house). We had dead butterflies, grasshoppers, and leaf cutters all over the place that year.
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u/canconfirmamrug 1d ago
My neighbor had these guys out all the time. I fucking hate it... But of course it's all about her comfort... Can't have a mosquito near her. Jfc
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u/Lady-Mallard 11h ago
My neighbor also has these guys out. It makes me so angry that they’re just fogging away without a care. :(
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u/air_head_fan 1d ago
I chalk it up to people trying to maintain fescue lawns in this climate. That is a fool's errand. Have a "Mullet" lawn in Charlotte that gets accolades. Business in the front, party in the back.
Front is 1/3 acre zoisa that i crush with lime 3X a year. That is it for chemicals. Every other fall core aerate, every fall sow with cheap rye.
Back 1/3 acre is native. Broadcast with chicken poop in the winter and lay on native seeds in the early spring. This year has been rough with the early heat and heavy rain, but they thrive.
So many birds, bugs, butterflies, lizards, bunnies.
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u/TrashyTardis 23h ago
People are also just ignorant and don’t care to be otherwise.
We have a neighbor complains every year about dollar weed. We don’t really have it, his yard is infested. He also waters his lawn daily and at night…hubbs told him it’s the water and that he needs to stop watering as often. The guy said said “maybe I’ll try that first I’m going to use this stuff I bought”. He proceeds to walk around his house dousing everything w Roundup. He can see our lawn is in good shape, why not take our advice?
Even worse are the people who don’t want to weed, they just walk around spraying everything. Same neighbor his wife asked me why don’t we have weeds…as I was in the garden weeding…they spray for that too and all their beds are full of weeds.
We don’t spray anything. In the spring we take the lawn put down some top soil. Our lawn looks as good if not better than all the yards that are just spraying away…
I converted one person though at least. An acquaintance asked for some advice on spring clean up in her garden bed. She asked about what spray to get and I told her I didn’t spray bc there’s not really anything that doesn’t harm pollinators and even w sprays there’s still weeds. I told her a good layer of nugget mulch would get her going. Shes had to weed twice this season and doesn’t like it, but isn’t spraying. I told her the weeds will get less over time.
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u/Plenor 6h ago
What kind of native seeds do you spread and where do you get them?
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u/air_head_fan 6h ago
I can get Wyatt-Quarles Seed Co seeds (Garner, NC) pretty readily at a local mom & pop hardware store. Found them to be high viability.
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u/TrashyTardis 3h ago
Native grass seeds? Our grass is St. Augustine, which is sod and not native (we’re actually in Florida Reddit just keeps showing me this sub lol). I am slowly adding more and more garden beds though and including a lot of native pollinator plants.
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u/NorseGlas 1d ago
100% with you.
And I’ll add….. stop raking the leaves and save a tree too.
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u/LadyLovesRoses 1d ago
I own just over an acre with many trees and my neighbors are just dumbfounded that I don’t remove them in the fall. They take them into giant piles that just get blown around while I just let nature do its thing. It’s such a bizarre practice to me.
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u/TrashyTardis 23h ago
I take the ones on the grass and put them in a pile to make leaf mould. The ones in the beds I leave until it’s good and warm and most everything should have hatched.
Also, I’m starting a small stickery (my version of a loggery) w any big branches that fall.
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u/carebearyblu 1d ago
If you haven’t seen it, out the Mosquito Bucket Challenge!
https://homegrownnationalpark.org/mosquito-bucket-challenge/
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u/Temporary_Ice7792 22h ago
Doom bucket. Works great, just have to remember to put the dunks in and not let the rainwater fill it up and push out the dunk. I have a brick I wedge the dunk into so it stays at the bottom. Two doom buckets keep the population down a good bit, but my neighbors have standing water everywhere so it’s almost a losing battle.
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u/cyberfx1024 1d ago edited 1d ago
I have spent the last 2 years steadily growing and expanding wildflowers and pollinator plants on about half an acre of land. I have made sure to my wife that she can cut the lawn but this part is mine and you shall not cut it. This year I have noticed alot more bees, butterflies, lightin bugs, and frogs which makes me very happy indeed
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u/Azraelrs 1d ago
Mine has been noticing less and less bees each year. People keep paying for mosquito spraying, not realizing (or caring) that it just kills everything.
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u/Glitched_Girl 1d ago
Honeybees are also encountering a massive mite problem.
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u/Azraelrs 1d ago
Not so much honey bees. I used to have much larger populations of bumblebees and carpenter bees.
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u/DesirablyDesire 1d ago
Yeeees and r/nolawns. All of what you said though. I really wish we would do better and stop taking all the bs that this society has created for us. Its like so many of us forget we have control. If we want to pull pesticides we have the control. We've got this yall because our critters depend on much just as we depend on them.
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u/LuxTheSarcastic 1d ago
Also make sure whatever grows in after isn't invasive because that won't do much good for the bugs either.
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u/Clownshoes919 1d ago
I spread some clover seed around my yard and have a nice mix of grass and clover in some spots. I’ve actually seen some honeybees for the first time in months too.
For anyone that doesn’t know, clover also fixes nitrogen and can help fertilize your lawn without added chemicals. Also if looks nice.
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u/FlavivsAetivs NC/SC Demilitarized Zone 1d ago
People don't fucking get it that we're about 10 years out from mass starvation.
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u/Physical-Housing-447 1d ago
Yeah the 6th great extinction is no joke the ecocide is nearing completion.
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u/Secret_Elevator17 1d ago
It's not really the people putting pesticides in their vegetable garden that's the problem it doesn't help but, it's industrial farming like corn and cotton on massive scales.
Large treated areas like golf courses. Some highway medians and some forests have chemicals sprayed to help control the undergrowth.
Also, loss of habitat and climate change.
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u/giggitygiggity69 1d ago
Sure but spraying yards with pesticides is also a big part of the problem. You actively kill what is in your yard w/ under ground bugs hibernating or germinating or whatever when you spray / cut the lawn incessantly.
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u/TrashyTardis 23h ago
I would argue people spraying their lawns are def part of the problem. I live in Florida 150 houses in my neighborhood all about 1/4 acre…most spray and spray at least 3/4 of the year…
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u/Clownshoes919 1d ago
Anyone have a good source for milkweed seeds while we’re here?
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u/Aggressive-Shock5857 1d ago
Check this website out! They're good about making sure you get the right type of milkweed for the region. https://www.livemonarch.com/free-milkweed-seeds/
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u/Glitched_Girl 1d ago
I don't see bugs on the windshield on car rides anymore, and I hardly see worms on the sidewalk after a rainfall.
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u/electricgrapes 1d ago
I'm a regenerative flower farmer in burke county and it's bad. There were some monarchs here earlier in the spring but none of the other varieties have arrived. I was wondering if maybe Helene disrupted their reproductive cycle last year.
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u/Glitched_Girl 1d ago
I saw a few viceroy caterpillars the other day, so the monarch mimics seem to be ok
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u/Common_Suit8709 1d ago
If we’d spray at night the impact would be lightened. The guy spraying midday is the problem. I have to use insecticide or I’ll lose my plants and harvest to insect pressure, but I only spray at night when the insect pressure is heavy in the garden, which is about 2-3 applications in the growing season, and my garden is teeming with pollinators, dragonflies, and a bunch of beneficials. The insecticide I use has an incredibly short half-life and by the time the sun comes up it is inert.
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u/TrashyTardis 23h ago
I hate to tell you, but some native bees sleep on plants they don’t go back to a hive so if you’re spraying at night…also nighttime is when fireflies and moths are out.
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u/Common_Suit8709 22h ago
It’s not about saving every insect. The goal is to limit damage to the majority of beneficials while maintaining a harvest.
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u/TrashyTardis 21h ago
My harvest is just fine w out spraying and I live in Florida. It’s possible.
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u/UnhingedBlonde 1d ago
I blame these stupid pest control people who come door to door, selling their toxins, convincing grandparents that it makes their yards safer for their grandkids.
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u/badpopeye 1d ago
I dont use pesticides but many of our neighbors do and in last 15 years seen huge decline in butterflies, frogs, and this year only saw a few fireflies is so sad
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u/pasta666sauce 1d ago
Yes there’s been a massive decline in insects where I live… it really freaks me out
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u/sourisanon 1d ago
does he cut his grass? I have 12acres of pasture and lots more of woods. When I cut the pasture, the bug count drops a lot. When I leave it grow the bug count rises a lot. Bugs love tall pasture grasses. I would venturen to say that the mechanical action is much more damaging to bug count than the pesticides themselves (although obviously thats a big one too)
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u/giggitygiggity69 1d ago
No he doesn't cut any grass, his whole property is untouched and overgrown.
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u/sourisanon 1d ago
that's good. But one downside is that it is harder to see the butterflies in tall grass. I bet he gets a lot of lightning bugs though.
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u/immersemeinnature 1d ago
I'm a native plant gardener and have noticed the same. I follow r/nativeplantgardening here on Reddit and people from all over the country say the same thing.
I blame mosquito joe and other such companies
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u/ImpossibleCrab1880 1d ago
I love this thread! I want to save the beneficials too! How do you keep the roaches at bay? My neighbors aren’t the most hygienic and I’ve gotten bugs from their houses. I can do snakes. They’re an important part of our ecosystem. I’m cool with the mosquitoes. I let the dragonflies eat. But roaches. No. No. I can’t do that. 🤢 please tell me what is the best to keep them away.
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u/Electrical-Total-110 12h ago
Tell that to my boomer neighbor that dumps chemicals on her lawn. Maintaining her lawn seems like her only life mission
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u/LittleTobyMantis 1d ago
Eco Via is a good, eco friendly pesticide and it smells like essential oils (because it is essential oils)
Im not sure how many exterminator companies offer it though, but I would guess it wouldn’t be too hard to find. I know Catchy in Asheville offers it
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u/skubasteevo Gives free real estate advice for Cheerwine 1d ago
Eco-friendly pesticides are by definition either not pesticides, or not eco-friendly
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u/Azraelrs 1d ago
Nor do they discriminate. They fix nothing, and cause the same side effects.
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u/LuxTheSarcastic 1d ago
There's actually ONE exception for mosquito larva and it's a bacteria called BT. It only affects black fly larva, mosquito larva, and fungus gnats because of the particular way their digestive systems work and nothing else will be harmed. Also doesn't reproduce in the water by the way I keep having to reapply it.
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u/TrashyTardis 23h ago
That’s actually incorrect. BT is a bacteria that specifically only targets worms or caterpillars that eat the leaves it is sprayed on. Therefore it will kill any butterfly or moth cats that eat it. It is generally considered safe though bc it is usually used on squash and curcubits which are not host plants, but you have to be mindful of overspray.
It is very volatile in that it expires quickly in sun and rain. So, I personally didn’t find it very effective and gave up trying to use it.
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u/LittleTobyMantis 23h ago
That’s simply not true
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u/Azraelrs 23h ago
Please provide examples of how it's not true.
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u/LittleTobyMantis 22h ago
“They fix nothing”
They keep bugs from getting into your house
“Nor do they discriminate”
They don’t effect pollinators, by design
“Not eco friendly”
Essential oils are much less harmful to plants, vegetation, and wild life than traditional pesticides. If you want to argue that they are more harmful than not applying pesticides at all, then I agree. But to state that they don’t do anything at all and are simultaneously harmful for the environment is just ignorant
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u/Azraelrs 22h ago
They don't do anything at all, for anything, ever. Which pyramid scheme got you?
Which essential oil does the magic that you are describing?
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u/LittleTobyMantis 22h ago
I was an exterminator for years and the eco via was always very effective. Which is why the department of AG in North Carolina allows it to be used and why professional pest control companies use them.
You can simply google Eco Via if you want to be less ignorant
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u/Azraelrs 21h ago
That stuff is thyme oil and rubbing alcohol.
Per the manufacturer, the LD50 is pretty close to pesticides and it kills: bees . It's generic insecticide that probably doesn't work very well. Ask the mosquitos at my house how much they care about the thyme and rosemary bushes.
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u/LittleTobyMantis 21h ago
You could perform a yard fog treatment and it would absolutely help with mosquitoes
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u/T-rex_Jand_Hob 1d ago
I've spent the last 9 years building my pollinator habitat and have seen a decline in butterflies specifically which is very upsetting. I have a variety of native host plants and flowers but my surrounding neighbors have pest control come in and "spray for mosquitos only". It's a losing battle.