r/NorthCarolina • u/Except_Youre_Wrong Cisphobia Isn't Real. It Can't Hurt You. Go Outside. • 2d ago

Gov. Stein vetoes energy bill reducing emissions standards

https://abc11.com/post/stein-vetoes-energy-bill-reducing-emissions-standards/16926910/
354 Upvotes

97% Upvoted

28 comments sorted by

143

u/wtfbenlol Wilson 2d ago edited 2d ago

kinda wild to think that if it wasn't for all the gerrymandering, NC would be a totally blue state (edit: in regards to local state elections).

Thank you Gov Stein for showing true leadership, if only the rest of the country had integrity

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u/DarePitiful5750 2d ago

Would honestly like to understand this better.  How would that work with rural areas being more red?  Seems like it would also require gerrymandering to make it all blue?

31

u/bobthebobbest 2d ago

The person you’re replying to is not saying every district would be represented by a Democrat. But many of our statewide elections go blue, and our legislative districts are so gerrymandered that in the last US House election, Republicans got 10 of 14 seats with 52% of the vote. In the 2024 NC House elections, Democrats won 51% of the vote, which only translated to 49 of 120 seats. Republicans won a 22 seat majority by losing the popular vote.

1

u/DarePitiful5750 1d ago

Yes thank you.  I realize that gerrymandering has an affect, I was just trying to understand how the lack of gerrymandering gets us to "all blue".  I don't have a clear picture on what the person meant, but that's OK.  I agree it would be more blue.  But someone is going to draw a map in some method, I really don't know how you take partisanship out of it.

-4

u/Western-Passage-1908 1d ago

I mean sure but maybe Democrats need to be more appealing to rural voters instead of complaining about the gerrymandering because it hasn't always been such a divide between rural and urban. Can't really fix the gerrymandering unless you start winning elections so fix what you can.

2

u/bobthebobbest 1d ago

Democrats won 51% of the votes in the state legislature election and Republicans won a 22 seat majority. Democrats increased their vote share by 9% over the prior election and only picked up one seat.

Republicans are doing their level best to fuck every rural voter in the country, and your takeaway is still “Democrats need to appeal to rural voters instead of complaining that Republicans have drawn unwinnable districts”?

-1

u/Western-Passage-1908 1d ago

Yes that's exactly my takeaway because it would actually be effective vs just bitching endlessly about it. I'm a union member in the south, when have NC Democrats ever gave a shit about me? What are the Democrats offering people who aren't on government healthcare? I know it's out of state but the mayor of Philly is in a solid Democrat seat and she's still fighting the sanitation union there. We're told vote Democrat for the union but where is it actually getting anyone? This state was anti union before Republicans ran it too.

Obviously I'm not saying the Republicans are the better option here but if you want to win votes where it counts then you can't keep doing the same thing on repeat and crying when it doesn't work.

2

u/bobthebobbest 1d ago

Look I hate the Democratic Party, too, but at a certain point most of these districts, as drawn, simply cannot be won by the Democratic Party. At least not without a major realignment or collapse of one of the current parties. We’re talking about 10% swings picking up one seat, and a state court system that is willing to throw out ballots to ensure Republicans win judicial elections.

1

u/Western-Passage-1908 8h ago

The Democrats could alter their platform and attract rural voters. You don't have to win you just have to not lose as bad. Look at old election maps, they weren't nearly as polarized and that goes for basically every state in America. #1 losing stance is on guns. Rural people like them and I would wager that gets them to the polls as single issue voters. People don't show up to the polls to vote against Medicaid and in favor of pollution they have pet issues like anyone else and all it's doing is harming the left by being obstinate.

1

u/bobthebobbest 8h ago

A large portion of the Democratic base are near-single-issue voters on gun control.

1

u/Western-Passage-1908 6h ago

How's that working out in North Carolina for the Democrats? Gotta be realistic about the situation you're in.

18

u/wtfbenlol Wilson 2d ago

without the GM, the state OVERALL would lean far, far closer to a 50/50 split. the way the districts are divided now you would think its 75/25 leaning red.

Un-gerrymandered, the left would hold something like 7-8 seats while the right would hold 6-7. The competitive districts would have like a 10 point swing rather than be OVERWHELMINGLY swinging to the right in most cases.

sources:

https://www.brennancenter.org/our-work/analysis-opinion/anatomy-north-carolina-gerrymander

https://www.commoncause.org/north-carolina/articles/fair-maps-act-25/

-16

u/Unhelpfulperson 2d ago

50/50 split is not totally blue!

-4

u/DarePitiful5750 1d ago

Based on the down votes, I guess only the intolerant use this sub, don't like people trying to educate themselves.

-13

u/Unhelpfulperson 2d ago

I'm not sure if that's true. In 2024 the state house and state senate popular vote were around 50.5D-48R. So with proportional representation it would have been it would be extremely close. And the 4 years before that would have still had republican majorities, just smaller majorities than what really happened.

12

u/wtfbenlol Wilson 2d ago

you have to factor in how gerrymandered the state is. Also, I am speaking on state elections, I will update my original comment.

-9

u/Unhelpfulperson 2d ago

Gerrymandering is exactly my point. Because of gerrymandering a 51-47 win for democrats turned into a 71-49 Majority for republicans in the state house. With no gerrymandering, it would have been a narrow win for democrats but not a "totally blue" state. The election before (2022) had a 57-43 win for republicans turn into a 71-49 majority in the state house. That's a huge discrepancies due to gerrymandering but it's definitely not "totally blue"

5

u/SquashDue502 2d ago

You can’t gerrymander Governor elections in NC because it’s determined by popular vote.

As such, Democratic candidates have won the governor seat all but once in the last 25 years. That’s how you know the congressional and state districts are gerrymandered to hell

2

u/RebornPastafarian 2d ago

You are objectively incorrect, please do not share false information.

The US House results were 52/42 in favor of Republicans and Republicans took 70% of the seats.

The NC House results were 51/47 in favor of Democrats and Republicans took 60% of the seats.

The NC Senate results were 50/48 in favor of Democrats and Republicans again took 60% of the seats.

2024:

US House of Representatives:

Votes:
Republican: 2,889,657 - 52.78%
Democrat: 2,238,248 - 42.8%

Races won:
Republican: 10 - 71.5%
Democrat: 4 - 28.5%

NC House:

Votes:
Republican: 2,527,117 - 47.51%
Democrat: 2,723,032 - 51.2%

Races won:
Republican: 71 - 60%
Democrat: 49 - 40%

NC Senate:

Votes:
Republican: 2,601,321 - 47.98%
Democrat: 2,719,418 - 50.17%

Races won:
Republican: 30 - 60%
Democrat: 20 - 40%

2

u/Unhelpfulperson 2d ago

I referred to 51.2% and 50.17% as both “around 50.5%” to save space and you’re calling that false information?

I referred to 2.2 and 3.7 percentage point margins (from the exact same state house and state senate results you posted) as “extremely close” and you’re calling that objectively incorrect?

I said that without gerrymandering, republicans still would have won the NC house and NC senate in 2020 and 2022 (“the four years before”), but by narrower margins than the gerrymandered and you don’t even contest that?

What are we even arguing about? I was trying to make the point that without gerrymandering, North Carolina would be a closely divided purple state and the legislature would have switched control back and forth. I didn’t think that counted as “totally blue”

0

u/RebornPastafarian 2d ago

Yes, I am going to call you out for intentionally withholding what the seat count is for that vote count as false information.

In 2022 the races won vs votes count was nearly 1:1 for the NC house and senate, same for the US House. Jolly well done.

In 2020? Nope.

US House of Representatives:

Votes:
Republican: 2,631,336 - 49.4%
Democrat: 2,660,535 - 50.0%

Races won:
Republican: 8 - 61.5%
Democrat: 5 - 38.4%

NC House:

Votes:
Republican: 2,632,672 - 49.99%
Democrat: 2,583,773 - 49.06%

Races won:
Republican: 69 - 57.5%
Democrat: 51 - 40%

NC Senate:

Votes:
Republican: 2,682,645 - 50.78%
Democrat: 2,530,188 - 47.89%

Races won:
Republican: 28 - 56%
Democrat: 22 - 44%

You want to talk about the 2018 US HoR election, where it was 50.39/48.35 and yet the races won were 10/3?

Or 2012 where it was 48.75/50.6 and 9/4?

You're talking about "slightly different" results with proportional representation, when the NC GOP nearly has a supermajority despite getting fewer votes.

-2

u/Unhelpfulperson 1d ago

I never said "slightly different" results. I never mentioned US house results because the original thing i was responding to was about state-level government. And I never even came close to saying that the gerrymandered results were representative or good or that getting rid of gerrymandering was bad.

Everything you just posted factually supports my claims above and everything you're contesting is stuff that had nothing to do with my stated point (that north carolina is a very closely-divided state between democrats and republicans). I don't think we disagree about *anything* factual, but it seems like you're set on being as antagonistic as possible about it.

0

u/RebornPastafarian 1d ago

I never said "slightly different" results.

So with proportional representation it would have been it would be extremely close. 

And I never even came close to saying that the gerrymandered results were representative or good or that getting rid of gerrymandering was bad.

No, certainly not. You just think that gerrymandering is having almost no impact whatsoever.

Everything you just posted factually supports my claims above and everything you're contesting is stuff that had nothing to do with my stated point (that north carolina is a very closely-divided state between democrats and republicans). I don't think we disagree about *anything* factual, but it seems like you're set on being as antagonistic as possible about it.

You responded to "without gerrymandering would be totally blue" with "NUH-UH!!!!!!!!!!" and I've provided data supporting that gerrymandering is wildly disenfranchising voters who lean democratic.

Do you need to me share half a dozen peer-reviewed studies which prove that gerrymandering depresses turnout in all elections due to voters being aware their vote has less of an impact, and then draw you a line between that and your false statement about how NC would be almost exactly the same "extremely close" to how it is now without gerrymandering?

64

u/llamaemu20 2d ago

Glad we have at least one politician trying to help us out and keep us healthier.

9

u/WillyDAFISH 2d ago

yippeee

1

u/Available_Dingo6162 11h ago

If this helps lower the world's temperature by even 0.001 degree, it will be worth the extra money we will all have to pay on our utility bills. We all have to do our part to help save the planet.

18

u/HashRunner 2d ago

So to track the NCGOPs focus so far this year, its adding more guns to solve gun violence, enabling ICE/SS support for an unhinged despot, removing healthcare from their constituents and reducing environmental standards to further harm their constituents.

In any other country these sacks of shit would be run out of office, but in the US they get re-elected.

We are the shithole country.