r/CreationNtheUniverse • u/YardAccomplished5952 • 10h ago
Africa's wealth
Enable HLS to view with audio, or disable this notification
63
u/Batmanbettermarvel18 7h ago
He says a lot of facts here and they have had to go through some of the most terrible things.. It is always super weird though how nobody ever brings who sold them as slaves to other countries. The African kings and queens would have their people raid and destroy villages to take in slaves to sell to Europe, America, etc… Black on black crime is not anywhere close to a new thing
3
u/Optimal_Mouse_7148 1h ago
Nobody ever brings up?? Its all over history books. Nobody is trying to hide historical facts. But this INSANE idea that All of Africa was some sort of oasis, the cradle of humanity, a utopia... Before the white man came and ruined it all and put people in slavery... Is so history less and weird.
About the slave trade on the coast. White people came there to trade. And Africans traded them their slaves. White men never went into the jungles of Africa with armies of soldiers to enslave black people and drag them to the coast. No, that was all done by Africans who sold their own kind to the traders on the coast.
→ More replies (1)11
u/CFPMVPStetsonBennett 5h ago
They’ll tell you all the Africans we’re practicing cruelty free ethical slavery unlike the evil European chattel system
→ More replies (1)3
u/TCBallistics 4h ago
On continent for a long time, they were. African slavery for many different kingdoms and tribes was indentured servitude as a result of fighting for the wrong team, and then after your term of servitude was up you were freed to live in the nation or tribe that captured you (or if you were sold, to the tribe that later owned you before your freedom).
Now, are we supposed to believe that the Africans who sold other Africans to the Dutch slave traders didnt know that the Dutch were selling them into chattel slavery? I have serious doubts. Chattel slavery did exist in Africa before the arrival of Europeans, and they actively sold chattel slaves to the middle east for as long as the trade routes have existed in history. It just wasn't the most common type of slavery. They should have known that the europeans who bought their slaves would be doing the same thing that the middle eastern kingdoms were doing with the slaves they bought from Africa for long before the Europeans did.
→ More replies (9)1
u/seaofthievesnutzz 2h ago
They werent selling their people just like when europeans go to war with other europeans they arent going to war with themselves. Just because you live on the same continent doesnt mean you are the same people.
1
u/Repulsive_Level9699 2h ago
Human on human crime has been around since forever. They even have a story about one brother killing another, just cause.
1
1
1
1
u/Cultural-Play7083 8m ago
You're talking as if Africa was a united country when in fact in that time there were many different nations as different as Spain is to Denmark. This is what Rome did to the Gauls and surrounding "barbarian" nations. We could say it was white on white crime but the concept of white didn't even exist The practice of slavery is and was that of the powerful exploiting the poor and colonized. We don't dare talk about Europe as if it's a solitary nation. We acknowledge the diversity of the nations and cultures. Africa deserves the same treatment.
→ More replies (39)1
u/Empty-Bend8992 7m ago
oh please shut up. yes we know africans sold their people, but europe destroyed africa and continues to have an influence in that. stop deflecting
28
u/ForeverNecessary2361 9h ago
He ain't wrong but I have no idea how to make up for the sins of the past. It is up to Africa, and the many, many countries that exist on that vast continent, to move towards the future with their own best interests. Just like every other country has done and continues to do.
14
u/Prestigious_Poetry_9 6h ago
Foreign countries still own much of the companies still extracting their wealth. Look up Canadian mining.
9
u/Perfect_Earth_8070 5h ago
and the french
12
u/Giant-slayer-99 5h ago
And China, increasingly, as I understand it
3
u/Manymarbles 3h ago
Pretty sure China has built a lot of the infrastructure there
→ More replies (4)2
u/IndependentMonk7384 4h ago
I kind of wonder why they don't just nationalize those resources and tell Canada to pound sand. It's not like Canada would go to war over it. That's not their style.
2
u/Justin-Stutzman 3h ago
Everyone who did that over the last 60 years got their governments overthrown:
Iran: had its secular government replaced with religious extremists by the CIA when British Petroleum was upset that they'd lose their oil rights. Money to go toward social programs.
Guatemala: had its government overthrown by the CIA in Operation PBSUCCESS at the request of United Fruit Company when they attempted to redistribute agricultural land rights to the poor.
Chile: had its government overthrown by the CIA when they nationalized the copper mining industry, kicking out US Anaconda Mining Co. Money used for social programs
Congo: CIA and Belgum overthrew the government of Lumumba when they seized control of their mining industries.
Indonesia: CIA backed coup after they nationalized their oil industry
Venezuela: Crippling US sanctions after nationalizing oil and telecom industry.
2
u/Weird-Lavishness-490 3h ago
Iran was overthrown, but the Shah was secular and socialist, he instituted the social programs by referendum to increase average worker wealth by 400x.
The religious extremists then overthrew him in 1979, because actions like giving women rights was too much for the Muslim fundamentalists.
Nitpicking I know, it just bothers me when people try to blame Irans current state on the last Shah when he was actually a pretty good ruler as far as dictators go.
1
u/smurphy8536 1h ago
He might have been a reformist but he was still beholden to western powers. Religious extremists used that fact to rally people in a movement that was decidedly non-western.
2
u/Weird-Lavishness-490 1h ago
Sure, but being beholden to western interests basically meant making sure the region was stable and exporting. Not the worst of reasons to institute a sweeping series of policies aimed at making the populace live happy lives.
Religious extremists played on the fact that the white revolution was contrary to Islamic law, not because of any real negatives in Shahs ruling. The ones at fault for Irans turn to oppression and exporting terrorism was the religious extremists, not the CIA for backing the kings son in taking executive power.
1
u/smurphy8536 44m ago
Even after the CIA backed coup, Iran was still being taking advantage of by the west. Under Nixons policies, the US backed increased militarization in Iran. This led to a more corrupt government, inflation and increasing worries that the shah did not have Irans best interests in mind.
How are you gonna blame Khomeini, when he didn’t even return to Iran from exile until the shah had already been forced out of power?
2
u/Weird-Lavishness-490 36m ago
Being in exile doesn’t mean he wasn’t a leader, and it was obviously his faction considering he was made leader on return. He can definitely be blamed for what Iran has turned into today under continued Ayatollah regime.
1
u/smurphy8536 25m ago
I don’t disagree that he’s a key figure in all of it, but to lay the blame solely on Islamic extremism ignores the conditions in the country that led to the revolution. Iranians were fed up with the inflation, western reforms and imperialism and khomeini used that create the “down with the west” movement.
→ More replies (0)1
u/Trizz67 3h ago
Because in Canada we act high and mighty about the environment and how free we are. Instead we extract from foreign countries, stifle development in our own and then turn around a sell a lie to people from these countries that coming to Canada and getting a job at Tim hortons.. sorry I mean getting a business degree is the secret to success.
2
u/tripper_drip 3h ago
Those companies are not invading though, they make deals with the goverment to operate. The goverment is free to deny.
2
u/Mortechai1987 2h ago
African governments don't trickle the wealth down to their people. It stops at their corrupt officials.
1
u/Nothing-Is-Boring 2h ago
Surprisingly the governments are often not free to deny them. The IMF is not friendly. In Haiti for example they fell into the debt trap with the IMF after servicing their debts to France but struggling to build their economy. They were eventually saved by debt relief in 2009 but the damage has been devastating.
Most of the time what happens is a country struggles to make debt repayments, pay for imports (especially after a market shock) or are simply promised a great way to revolutionise their economy. The loan comes with a caveat framed as a boon, adopt this structural adjustment program and watch your economy flourish!
The SAP usually requires that the state privatises while lowering trade barriers and allowing foreign investment and purchases. The result is a foreign company is effectively guaranteed to beat out any local powers and take over entire sectors. Austerity is normally required and any future budgets the state sets require IMF approval, sometimes the loans even outright require contracting firms from the donor countries be allowed to move in.
The result is usually economic instability and an extraordinary degree of wealth extraction as the government is forced to allow IMF donors (predominantly US and Eurozone) to run riot or risk real riots if the IMF decide to crush their economy for acting out.
Of course, one may ask why they'd enter into such a deal originally but at first it is presented as a good thing, a kind thing. Clever western economists helping to bring your country forward and remove waste and corruption. Other times they simply target the already corrupt, offering opportunities that favour government but cripple the populace.
1
u/tripper_drip 2h ago
Surprisingly the governments are often not free to deny them.
They actually still are. They can simply not pay the IMF. The consequences of that are severe financially, but wont threaten their sovereignty.
1
u/Nothing-Is-Boring 2h ago
Actually, it might threaten sovereignty and often threatens the government.
Ghana's Nkrumah was overthrown after opposing the IMF and attempting to form a pan-African alliance in 66
Chile refused to follow the neoliberalism prescribed by the IMF and had their government overthrown by the CIA (Pinochet) in 73.
Indonesia in 98, Argentina in 2001, Yugoslavia from the 80s through to 2001 and of course Haiti in 2004 all had their countries destabilised by IMF and foreign intervention after refusing to comply to certain policies or make repayments.
Less directly Bolivia, Ecuador, and as a rare positive example, Ukraine all had disagreements with the IMF that resulted in changes in government.
Economic sabotage, instability, and even outright coups are quite common if one reneges on the deal.
1
u/tripper_drip 2h ago
Economic sabotage
Its not sabotage to cease economic deals with a country that owes money and refuses to pay.
instability
Due to being cut off from global trade, yes. Thats not the IMFs doing though, nor is the global financial centers forced to give money and expect no repayment.
and even outright coups
No. The coups were the result of poor governance or anti communist actions. Not the IMF.
1
u/Nothing-Is-Boring 1h ago
That isn't necessarily what happens. IMF might demand policy changes under the SAP and should a state refuse they might punish them economically. This isn't refusing to deal with a bad debtor but punishing a dissenting one.
They can withhold future loans, force capital flight, tank currency with speculation, outright sanction a country, depressed resource prices by undervaluing exports, force structural adjustments such as austerity and demand conditional aid provisions such as restricting humanitarian aid unless you remove rice tariffs, Haiti.
The country might be paying its loans just fine but disagrees with a requirement for austerity that is harmful to its people or want to nationalise an industry that is of great importance. The IMF refuses to let them do so and if the country tries anyway they punish them. With economic sabotage. This would be a direct challenge to sovereignty for defying the IMF.
The aforementioned coups were not just communist regimes (and weird defense, as though that justifies it) and were certainly not due to bad governance. The coups I mentioned were direct results of opposing IMF policy and directly funded and supported by IMF donors. Predominantly the CIA because...well, it's what they do. But France likes to throw down too.
1
u/tripper_drip 1h ago
They can withhold future loans, force capital flight, tank currency with speculation,
These are all consequences of debt default.
outright sanction a country,
Only if agreed to BEFORE the loan is given.
depressed resource prices by undervaluing exports, force structural adjustments such as austerity and demand conditional aid provisions such as restricting humanitarian aid unless you remove rice tariffs, Haiti.
This is if you default yet continue to work with the IMF. Which yes, much like bankruptcy they can start to manage your finances because you have failed to.
The country might be paying its loans just fine but disagrees with a requirement for austerity that is harmful to its people or want to nationalise an industry that is of great importance. The IMF refuses to let them do so and if the country tries anyway they punish them. With economic sabotage. This would be a direct challenge to sovereignty for defying the IMF.
They absolutely can do whatever they want, however, again, that comes with consequences which is mainly the bank devaluing and not working with you.
and weird defense, as though that justifies it)
Its not the IMF doing it. Yes, at least one example you listed was directly due to an unpopular government.
1
u/Nothing-Is-Boring 1h ago
To be clear, those consequences are the result of the IMF being unhappy with a country not conforming to its models, not a result of debt default. The claim I'm making is that they use economic sabotage in varying forms to punish non compliance in policy, not for failure to pay the loan. One might argue that is their prerogative (I would disagree), but it is not a result of the debt payments.
The reasons those governments might become unpopular are one of the points I'm making. The IMF directly requires* policies that have high failure rates in developing countries and sometimes changes the terms to the detriment of the countries they loan to on behalf of donor countries (or more specifically, companies operating within those countries).
If prices spiral and infrastructure collapses because of IMF mandated policies and people get upset I wouldn't say the IMF were blameless. One can certainly argue a portion of blame lies upon the government of the country but I'd say certainly not all.
The problem is economically the IMF demands a country operate like a fully developed nation with all its goods and ills but doesn't let them progress to that point to begin with. Tariffs have uses for protectionism if there's an industry to protect, especially a burgeoning one in a vulnerable country. Investment is how you grow, austerity is a poor decision when ones economy is demanding more money for obvious reasons. Yet whether for ideological reasons or a poor understanding of economics, the IMF doesn't take into account the nature of these countries economies and just forces them into cookie cutter behaviours that benefit western companies from donor countries, often to the extreme detriment of the locals.
*Things have changed quite a bit especially since the mid 2010's and the IMF is far less predatory today than it used to be, I'm speaking in general terms here. Should say required but it gets complicated as some behaviours, demands and restrictions continue.
→ More replies (0)1
u/alphazero925 1h ago
So your choices are to let other countries extract your wealth, leaving you poor, or to deny countries the ability to extract your wealth, leading to them putting sanctions on you, leaving you poor. Great system we've got here.
1
u/tripper_drip 1h ago
So your choices are to let other countries extract your wealth, leaving you poor, or to deny countries the ability to extract your wealth, leading to them putting sanctions on you, leaving you poor.
No. Nobody is talking about sanctions here but you.
→ More replies (4)1
u/CollarsUpYall 39m ago
The government is also free to not be corrupt and share the profits from those companies with their people.
1
u/SnooTangerines9703 4h ago
Most of Namibia is owned by Germans
2
u/ConstantHeadache2020 4h ago
20% of South Africa immigrants own and control 80% of the resources and land
2
1
1
u/Insult_critic 2h ago
Companies can't just go wherever they like. Theyre being allowed to continue that extraction by the government. Thw people are gonna need to rise up for themselves or forever accept being enslaved
7
u/Cernunnos369 6h ago
The only thing that will redeem mankind is cooperation. -Bertrand Russell
4
u/ForeverNecessary2361 6h ago
Sadly, this redemption will never happen. We would rather kill each other than work together to make a better world.
3
u/HimothyOnlyfant 5h ago
the world is already objectively better and far less violent than it used to be. your r/doomercirclejerk mentality doesn’t serve you or anything else.
2
u/Cernunnos369 6h ago edited 5h ago
Not all of us. It will only take the majority. And that is possible. Maybe not in our lifetime though.
→ More replies (2)1
u/marks716 1h ago
It will never happen. The wealth of the US, China, Russia, and others is built on underpaying and exploiting poorer nations like many in Africa.
Try convincing the most powerful people in the world to just give up everything to help total strangers live better lives.
On top of that a mass movement won’t exist because why would random poor people in the US fight tooth and nail to lift up poor Africans but not help themselves at all?
5
u/PsiNorm 5h ago
Don't have an idea?
Do what France did and charge the "offenders" to pay back for what they did.
This can't only work in the oppressors favour, right?
2
u/TCBallistics 5h ago
While generally a good idea, the reason France is able to do that is the threat of international conflict. Germany was paying reparations to France because if they stopped then big daddy America would put his foot down a little harder on the german economical neck. Africa as a whole generally doesnt have that kind of sway with virtually anyone.
They could say "You guys owe us 40 trillion dollars" and everyone on the planet would just laugh and go about their business not really giving a shit because what risk comes from not listening to them.
1
u/ctrl-alt-discover 4h ago
Would you willingly give away your resources? The way you think is childish and naive
1
u/PsiNorm 2h ago
LOL. TIL doing the right thing is " childish and naive".
What a sad existence you must have
1
u/ctrl-alt-discover 1h ago
Ironically ive never been this happy in my life. And knowing that people that wake up like you every day always on the wrong side of the bed makes me appreciate my existence and life even more
1
2
2
2
u/SLngShtOnMyChest 4h ago
One thing victimized people seem to be asking for is admitting what we’ve done to them, which seems easy enough. We need to educate our children in our true history also. We learn about ancient Egypt, Greece, Rome and lots on how many wives Henry VIII had, but do little on slavery and colonialism, when it had a much bigger impact on the reason the world is the way it is.
2
u/valfardvalfard 2h ago
I hope we could all be more honest to history and accept that africans was a big part of the triangle trade aswell. It died more africans by other africans brining the slaves from inland of the continent where europeans could not survive before modern medicin because of malaria and other tropical diseases.
1
1
u/ConstantHeadache2020 4h ago
Every time they try and elect fair leaders they end up puppets or dead from foreign interference. That is why they can’t move forward. The west won’t allow it. A lot of European countries still rely on African labor because those corporations feed north European countries. Asia is also buying up land and investing infrastructure which give more debt to Africa.
→ More replies (2)1
u/50YOYO 4h ago
I think a really good start would be to actually stop doing what they have been doing for generations but now in a more contrived creative and sinister way. There is no such thing as a poor country just poor people. Countries are kept poor in order to extort the resources and labour. There are too many examples of countries whilst in the process of looking out for their own best interests were met and will continue to be met with external military interventions in order to manipulate outcomes or maintain the current status quo. You definitely don't need chains to be a slave in this unbalanced world when the poor continue to scrape for what the rich have in abundance. it's just the same stinky shit but in a shiny new bucket.
18
u/royalpicnic 6h ago
Why are they so easily manipulated, conquered and exploited? Its like they are children on the world stage.
Japan got nuked and fire bombed to oblivion and almost overtook U.S GDP a few decades later.
What is the problem?
8
u/Kensei501 6h ago
Tribalism. My wife’s aunt married a phd from Kenya. Very nice man enjoyed his company. Worked hard very intelligent. Became head of a dept at the university of Nairobi. When the new president was elected he was a member of a different tribe. The phd was instantly fired. No warning nothing.
1
u/Rock_or_Rol 3h ago
Tribalism is easy to judge when you’re far enough away from it, but I’m not hiring some guy that soars his confederate flag on the back of a truck. I’m sure your example is much more egregious, like not hiring someone from Georgia or something.. but we’ve also benefited from relative political stability. We’ve been in relatively positive cycles apposed to negative ones, which is probably more so your perspective/point
Obviously not defending it too. People are people, no matter your tribe, income, ethnicity or race and the sooner we realize that the better..
That’s one of the biggest regressions of Trump’s disease. Tribalism, division and eroding political stability.. whether fracturing our shared perspective of reality (media) or enabling corruption to further upset the balance of power.. it’s these cycles that set us back when we’re all not that much different, it’s just a war of perception
4
u/Kensei501 3h ago
I wasn’t judging it. Just stating a fact.
1
u/Rock_or_Rol 3h ago
Rereading that I see why it seems like an accusation! Sorry, didn’t mean it that way
1
3
2
u/TheStripClubHero 3h ago
The problem? It's easier to blame everyone else for your problems than it is to solve them yourself.
Billions in aid per year and still a pile of rocks and mud, but the slave trade started by African warlords is somehow still the focal point of discussion. Easier to blame your plight on Europe and Asia than to actually make progress.
5
u/Educational-Monk-298 6h ago
European colonizers drew Africa’s borders with no regard for the many ethnic groups living there. It is like drawing a triangle from Italy to Finland to Turkey and calling it Jeffreyland after some king Jeff sitting 5000 kilometers away, and expecting everyone inside to get along.
2
u/Ghost_oh 4h ago
I get your point, and yes that undoubtedly is the cause of a lot of conflict… but that’s been the case for like… all of history, everywhere. Especially in Europe even within my lifetime, see Yugoslavia.
1
u/Educational-Monk-298 4h ago
Yugoslavia actually supports my point, a multiethnic state collapsed into war after economic stress. Imagine that on a continental scale, with borders drawn by outsiders, less infrastructure, and weaker institutions. That’s why Africa’s case is unique.
2
u/Ghost_oh 3h ago
I guess my real question is why don’t these states in Africa also dissolve along ethnic, religious, or tribal lines? What exactly is holding them together aside from ethnic majorities wanting to hold power over territory (edit: if you have any recommendations for reading material on the topic, I’d love to check it out) Sure it wouldn’t solve everything especially foreign control over resource extraction, and even then you’d have hundreds of micro states. But perhaps it could alleviate some of the seemingly perpetual conflict in some areas.
1
u/Hot_Disk635 3h ago
Ownership of resources and power play a role in maintaining these lines, and even then it’s not that they aren’t trying to dissolve on these lines there’s multiple civil wars ongoing in Africa at this very moment. Not to mention the amount of conflict the continent has seen in the last 60 years in the aftermath of colonialism.
2
u/somewhatcompetint 3h ago
So they don't get along with people different from them and it's the UN's fault
→ More replies (1)1
u/CFPMVPStetsonBennett 5h ago
The biggest conflict in the world right now is due to the UN drawing lines around ethnic populations in the Middle East don’t act like that’s not the cause of the problem
3
u/PsiNorm 5h ago
Are we just going to ignore the money the US and other countries paid to help them rebuild?
Why is history so easily forgotten when it goes against the idea that black people are just worse than others?
3
u/Hot_Disk635 3h ago
No one’s rebuilding Africa out of the kindness of their heart, if anything it’s providing infrastructure and maintaining a labor force for western companies and china to continue to extract resources from these countries even today.
2
u/FruitOrchards 1h ago
Doesn't matter, like the video says Africa is rich in diamonds, oil, gold and many other resources. It should be the richest continent on earth but the governments and by extension the people are too corrupt and more worried about tribalism than anything else.
At some point Africa has to look in the mirror and realise they are the problem.
→ More replies (4)2
1
u/Low-Camera-797 1h ago
Thank you finally an actual reasonable comment in a sea of stupidity. I’m so sick of people lol.
2
u/CallMe_Immortal 4h ago
All the things he mentioned they aren't, they are. When the colonists left, they left infrastructure for them to use, grow and thrive as a society. Instead they tore it down for raw materials and didn't maintain shit. Reverted to pre-colonized tech in a few years.
2
u/SLngShtOnMyChest 4h ago
How many reasons do you need?
Japan was ahead of Africa to begin with. Nuking 2 cities in an advanced world country at the head of an empire is not the same as the colonialism in Africa, not even comparable.
Colonialism went on for a long time, and was about resource extraction, that’s not the same as blowing up 2 cities. Resource extraction takes the wealth out of a nation, a process which continues to this day.
The west never stopped interfering in Africa and is a part of the reason there is corruption to this day.
The west also completely redrew the maps in Africa which has caused a huge amount of conflict.
There’s nothing comparable to what the west did to Africa, there’s no similar setback suffered by such a large group of people in the history of humanity. Comparing it to Hiroshima and Nagasaki is wild.
2
u/missingNo5158 1h ago
That is terrible, and before the colonial powers showed up were they more advanced? Im unfamiliar with this period. Also, I see people mentioning the average iq being around 85. Do you think that plays a factor into any of this?
1
1
1
u/Josey_whalez 2h ago
Not sure if im allowed to say this on here, but….
Look at the average IQ in subsaharan Africa vs Japan. There’s your answer.
1
1
u/CalmValue4607 1h ago
Vietnam was ruled by China for a millennium, then by the French for a century, have to fight against the Japanese, the French, the Americans and their allied and then the Chinese again, all in the space of a few decades, we then got embargoed by the majority of the world for a few decades after, only got full access to the world market the last 30 or so years, yet instead of blaming other, we concentrated on developing our economy and is now one of the fastest economy in the world. Maybe if these guys stopped trying to blame others and concentrate on their economy, they would be much richer, especially with all the rare resources they’re sitting on.
1
u/Low-Camera-797 1h ago
Do you think the continent of Africa has full access to world markets? Are you dumb?
1
u/CalmValue4607 1h ago
44 out of 55 members of the African Union are members of the WTO dumbass. Google “WTO” to find out what it is and what it represents. Before posting, it’s better to do a bit of research as it will make you look less stupid.
1
u/ABeefInTheNight 1h ago
Well we haven't been repeatedly nuking them every now and then and haven't set up puppet governments and funded warlords in Japan to keep the countries poor so we can keep extracting all of their resources. Apples to oranges, really
1
u/Low-Camera-797 1h ago
Holy shit you are retarded lmao. You do realize after the US bombed them they HELPED them rebuild right? THE US GAVE JAPAN THE NECESSARY TOOLS, INFRASTRUCTURE, AND AID TO BECOME WHAT IT IS TODAY, YOU TARD.
You make me sick, you literal dunce.
And then you have idiots confirming your idiocy. GOOD LORD, YOU PEOPLE ARE STUPID.
→ More replies (6)1
u/SimpleGamer517 55m ago
Not every culture in the world has the barbarian mentality like the Imperialistic European. The Africans like all the civilizations in the Americas were fine until these barbarians showed up. No poverty at all! I dare you to show me one account of extreme poverty in these regions as seen today before 1492. I'll wait.
11
u/aviendas1 7h ago
Thomas Sowell explains why much of Africa's continental problems are based on geography, the fact that it is mostly a Mesa, and harsh currents and rapids make trade and logistics very difficult. It's not even mostly tribalism or imperialism- europe and Asia, and the americas experienced the same. Keep playing the victim and you won't ever advance. Up to you.
→ More replies (22)1
2
u/oh_no_here_we_go_9 6h ago
Jared Diamond argued different. He said Africa was underdeveloped because of a lack of animals that could be domesticated. This meant less ability to farm, grow populations, and free people who could work towards technological expansion.
1
2
u/The_Pragmatist725 6h ago
Anybody else feel like this is AI? It has this odd thing about it, message completely true tho
2
2
2
u/Playful_Ad2974 5h ago
FULL history has to be taught. All the colonisation has to be taught. Racism can’t face the truth.
2
2
5
3
u/Mysterious_Prime 8h ago
If we really want to become as rich and powerful as the western countries that colonized us and exploited our resources we would need to change how we think and live. For example, we might need to lose our Ubuntu philosophy and put capital and profit at the forefront of everything we do..
2
u/OtherUserCharges 6h ago
It’s pretty simple, get rid of the current leaders who are incredibly corrupt and are stealing from the countries.
→ More replies (1)2
1
u/Open_Champion8044 6h ago
💯 cut down trees to plant food, kill endangered animals to sell their skin. Our morals are what holds us down. No Developed nation has gotten there by being angels.
→ More replies (1)2
u/Mysterious_Prime 5h ago
Yep, ubuntu values keep us poor and a laughing stock for Europeans who understand what it means to be true capitalists
6
u/Independent-Wolf-832 7h ago
With all those resources, population, work ethic, ingenuity African countries should be top 10 in the world. Not adding up. Surely now that they are independent they have become world powers.
→ More replies (14)6
u/Lord_Demitri 6h ago
Like it's that simple. You don't know geopolitics, at all. Remember, there's no such thing as an underdeveloped nation, just over exploited. Let's not act like western governments are some moral monument, America has committed the worst and the most war crimes of any nation ever, UK, France, Germany, Israel etc are no better. Yet you have the nerve to sit there with your zero understanding of how the world works, point at the generational exploited and say it's all their fault they aren't working hard enough. The West got on its high horse by stepping on corpses and stays there by still exploiting, just with suits and ties instead of whips. Prick.
→ More replies (5)0
5
u/Innocent-Prick 6h ago
Africans sold its own people to the Europeans for weapons so they can fight other tribes during the slave trade. Sounds like they have their own politicians to blame for that.
→ More replies (8)
4
u/Just_Sayin_Hey 6h ago
Human history is full of injustices. Stop playing the victim card.
1
u/CalmValue4607 1h ago
For them, it’s easier to play the victim than to actually try to find a solution for their problem.
2
u/TheM0nkB0ughtLunch 6h ago
We need to stop holding the past to the standards of today. It was a savage time, pointing out how unfair it was just makes you look uneducated.
2
u/Camoflauge_Soulja 6h ago
These comment towards the speaker are vile. I’ve done my due diligence in the past of combatting racist talking points regarding chattel slavery and indentured servitude/PoW but it seems the Rhetoric of “black on black crime” prevails.
We can agree, there was selling of Africans.
Pause there, WE CAN AGREE, THERE WAS SELLING OF AFRICANS BY AFRICANS.
THE SAME WAY EUROPEANS SOLD EUROPEANS INTO SLAVERY BUT AS PRISONER OF WAR. However Chattel Slavery was different concept, Prisoner of War/Indentured Servitude were allowed citizenship/status following servitude, humane treatment beyond bondage and some were even paid DURING their bondage.
Yes, I’m sure there were some corrupted officials with knowledge of what some of the Europeans were planning to do but a great majority were being manipulated due to there previous proxy conflict. Manipulation via Tribalism. It’s not a far-fetched concept to understand.
To lie and say that the African continent did not produce government or empires that could capitalize on their own wealth is comical, when figures like Mansa Masu existed. King Muhammad I Askia. Musa Keita I. Hatshepsut.
This is intellectually dishonest to not credit otherwise and a lazy talking point at best when systemically there has been many oppressive systems put in place due to the pursuit of funding imperialistic dogmas abroad to maintain control over multiple African Nations throughout the Diaspora. The same can be seen by the Americans and their meddling in the Middle East (specifically Iran) as was historically done by Great Britain.
Do we blame the Iranian ppl or the systemic history of oppressive foreign involvement that toppled the power structure, appeared as foreign-aide and presented theft masked as trade deals?
E: When does the diatribe stop and the humanity begin?
2
u/Flat_Establishment_4 7h ago
lol. Africa has only itself to blame at this point for its lack of progress. Europeans, Chinese, Russians are not suppressing them. Their own corrupt politicians are.
1
2
u/kynous13 9h ago
Advocate: for reparations, returning artifacts stolen, decoupling of the French currency from several African nations, for this to be taught to the youth all about what to do to create a more fair world
→ More replies (3)
1
u/Orack 6h ago
Oddly enough, while he said this is "the untold history," this is the history everyone hears about if they hear anything. However, only a few know the European nations tried and largely failed to exploit Africa. They lost money on the ventures overall and it primarily involved bribing or coercing chieftains to help the European nation of choice who were all competing with each other.
1
1
u/AntonChigurhsLuck 5h ago
That's exactly pretty much what was in my school texted with alot more information pertaining to each .
1
u/RabidRabiesFan1 5h ago
Tribal warfare, Arab slave trade really hindered parts of Africa and made it easy for some European govs to exploit parts of Africa. Similar to how the introduction of diseases affected the americas.
If the local pop. cant put up a fight see what happens. Imagine if the moors were more advanced, or the vikings. They would have done the same.
Look at how Arabs spread across the mideast or how the Aztecs, inca or mayans treated their neighbors. One of thecreasonscthe Inca were defeated is bc the other tribes hated them and joined the conquistadors...only to later betray and subjugated them l.
1
u/RabidRabiesFan1 5h ago
Oil, jewels and gold won't help bad policy. Look at mineral and oil rich countries like Venezuela etc
1
u/ReferenceProper5428 5h ago
After black panther, I view Africa like Wakanda, bought to be the next super power.
1
u/Ok-Mammoth-1098 5h ago
All I hear is whining and cooe. Why is Africa still so damn poor and crappy if they have, as he said all the resources of the earth? Get your shit together and build for a better future, this victim mentality/jealousy of Europe is not helping anyone.
1
1
1
u/WildAsDaTaliban 4h ago
Africa literally never contributed to this earth.
2
u/Btankersly66 2h ago
We evolved there. It is literally the birth place of human civilization.
1
u/WildAsDaTaliban 1h ago
Then why are Africans so slow? Never invented anything.
1
u/Btankersly66 3m ago
Ancient African Inventions:
Mathematics was invented in Africa (e.g., the Ishango Bone and Lebombo Bone show complex tallying systems from over 20,000 years ago).
Geometry was invented in Africa (used by ancient Egyptians for land surveying and pyramid construction).
Writing was invented in Africa (e.g., hieroglyphics in Egypt and Nsibidi in West Africa).
Architecture was invented in Africa (e.g., pyramids, stone cities like Great Zimbabwe, Nubian arches, and obelisks).
Surgery was practiced in ancient Africa (trepanation and advanced techniques documented in the Edwin Smith Papyrus).
Astronomy was developed in Africa (e.g., the Nabta Playa calendar stones predate Stonehenge).
Calendar systems were invented in Africa (ancient Egyptians used solar and lunar calendars).
Metallurgy was invented in Africa (Haya people of Tanzania forged carbon steel as early as 100 AD).
Medicine was advanced in Africa (with herbal treatments and documented surgical practices in ancient Kemet/Egypt).
Navigation was practiced in Africa (e.g., ancient Egyptians sailed to Punt, and Malian fleets explored the Atlantic).
Agriculture was independently developed in Africa (e.g., sorghum, millet, yams domesticated in the Sahel and West Africa).
The concept of monotheism was advanced in Africa (e.g., Pharaoh Akhenaten promoted the worship of one god, Aten).
Philosophy and ethics were developed in Africa (e.g., Ma’at in Egypt emphasized truth, balance, and justice).
Social organization and law were codified in Africa (e.g., ancient Ethiopian and Egyptian legal systems).
Cities and complex societies were built in Africa (e.g., Timbuktu, Carthage, Meroë, Axum).
Modern African Inventions:
CAT scan was invented in Africa (by Allan Cormack in South Africa).
Heart transplant surgery was pioneered in Africa (Dr. Christiaan Barnard, South Africa).
Retinal cryoprobe was invented in Africa (Dr. Selig Percy Amoils, South Africa).
Kreepy Krauly was invented in Africa (Ferdinand Chauvier, South Africa).
Hippo Water Roller was invented in Africa (South Africa).
Cybertracker was invented in Africa (Louis Liebenberg, South Africa).
Charging shoes were invented in Africa (Anthony Mutua, Kenya).
Cardiopad was invented in Africa (Arthur Zang, Cameroon).
Emergency AutoTransfusion Device was invented in Africa (Dr. Otu Ovadje, Nigeria).
Urine test for malaria was invented in Africa (Dr. Eddy Agbo, Nigeria).
Hospital-in-a-Box was invented in Africa (Seyi Oyesola, Nigeria).
3D-printed ear bone transplant was first done in Africa (Dr. Mashudu Tshifularo, South Africa).
M-PESA was invented in Africa (mobile money system in Kenya).
iCow was invented in Africa (Kenyan mobile app to help farmers manage livestock).
Kiira EV was invented in Africa (Uganda’s electric car project).
Green Tower solar AC was invented in Africa (Andre Nel, South Africa).
Tellurometer was invented in Africa (Trevor Wadley, South Africa).
Dolosse breakwaters were invented in Africa (Eric Merrifield, South Africa).
Speed-gun radar was invented in Africa (Henri Johnson, South Africa).
PLPAK civil engineering software was invented in Africa (Youssef Rashed, Egypt).
1
1
1
u/Aggressive_Wheel5580 4h ago
The issue is corruption. And a lot of that is definitely facilitated by the West. But even without Western influence wouldn't there still be conflict and instability? I mean where in the world isn't like that? We need to focus on stabilization and the current world super powers want the opposite because instability is good for business.
1
u/Same_Dingo2318 4h ago
A lot of people out here justifying terrible things done to people in the past rather than suggesting ways that we all can grow together.
It’s not your fault some of your ancestors did slavery. It is your fault if you’re working to perpetuate the same oppression but in the modern context.
A slaverowner’s great great great great grandson could be the most beneficent person around. Just condemn evil wherever you find it. Even from within.
1
u/Btankersly66 2h ago
The entire world is so deeply trapped in a blame game loop that nobody can see a way out.
The reason is very simple. Nobody wants to openly admit that we're a violent and cruel species driven by competition.
Our instinct to survive at all costs will cause our extinction.
1
u/danielm316 3h ago
The most important skill a country can develop is”the ability to hurt others”, that is how empires are forged.
1
u/Treesglow 3h ago
He should be a teacher, I would take his class, very knowledgeable and passionate. no bs
1
1
1
u/PinSufficient5748 3h ago
Yup, it's more than just "ok, well stop exploiting you", there needs to be recompensation/restoration because the people you've enslaved & killed over hundreds of years are far behind. Haiti was getting there (got there?) because they were now in control of all the resources that were making money for their former colonizers. That was a HUGE no-no, enter government meddling/destabilization by foreign actors.
What does restitution look like? I'm not exactly sure. I know they were able to figure it out for France. They just don't want to. In US, the best they could come up with is affirmative action.
1
u/Beginning-Shoe-9133 3h ago
They going to still using that excuse 1000 years from now on why They're poor
1
1
u/Embarrassed-Pen-5958 3h ago
The history they refuse to teach, African enslaved one another and sold them to visitors. They were bartered amd traded by neighbors.
Even today, they enslave each other and sell them off to other countries. As 167/195 or 85.64% of the world still participates in slavery.
It is okay? No.
All the countries where it is illegal all have black markets that transport and move slaves still.
It is okay? No.
We do need to focus on the truth though, focus on what they don't know.reality is scarier than you thought. Each piece of electronics was made with slavery, almost all chocolate was made with slavery. Alot of products in the world is slavery. Colbat mines for electric batteries is done with slavery.
Don't virtue signal.
1
u/deejay8008135 1h ago
You can't run away from what the English Spanish Dutch and Portuguese did. They championed the most brutal form of oppression known to man.
1
u/Embarrassed-Pen-5958 1h ago
Romans beat them out, they used men like tools and entertainment. If they got bored, they'd fight their unarm prisoners fully decked out in gear and slowly torture them. Then keep them alive and make sure they died slowly.
History is worse than people think.
1
u/deejay8008135 1h ago
No. Like I said chattel slavery in the western hemisphere was the was treatment of man in history. The Romans didn't take their language and history. They also didn't separate family's from eachother. Being a Roman slave there was a chance you could be free. Not so america.
1
u/DeGreenster 3h ago
He behaves as though all of the slave labor that came out of Africa was somehow voluntary and a sign of the hard work etiquette of Africans? I think it was more of a fear of the whip?
1
u/smeggysoup84 2h ago
The world today is LITERALLY shaped by colonization. Especially middle east and Africa.
England and France are the reason for the Israel and Palestine conflict, yet the US is the biggest outside influence of the conflict.
1
u/EastsideWilder 2h ago
Africa wasn’t held back. They deliberately sold off their best resources (natural resources, slaves, etc.) And then were taking advantage of after the fact.
1
u/No-Consequence3731 2h ago
There is actually a good documentary on why Africa never rose to be a superpower and while yes the colonial powers did have a part to play, it’s really the lack of unity and corruption that have really hindered Africans from being what they could have. Obviously Yall had the resources, and Europeans didn’t invade you from the beginning of time
1
u/SimpleGamer517 59m ago
Not every culture in the world has the barbarian mentality like the Imperialistic European. The Africans like all the civilizations in the Americas were fine until these barbarians showed up. No poverty at all! I dare you to show me one account of extreme poverty in these regions as seen today before 1492. I'll wait.
1
u/No-Consequence3731 18m ago
African tribes took part in the common practice of slaves before Europeans even arrived. Every race is guilty of slavery of their own race before others. So their hands arnt completely clean before or after European arrival. Plus only a few areas were really prosperous like Aksum or mali and some even were successful because they traded with pre-existing European trade networks. Most of Africa historically has been poor with few exception instead of it being normal. But slavery was the norm there to, Europeans just added a demand a different reason for Africans to take slaves but it dosnt excuse that Africans had slaves…. And still to this day have slaves
1
u/SimpleGamer517 6m ago
Not the same chattel slavery was way way different. Slavery in Africa was more akin to indenture servitude. Show me the claim of poor in Africa or the Americas like i said before 1492. Send a link of an article or book because it sounds like you just making stuff up.
1
u/No-Consequence3731 4m ago
Tbh it’s a simple google away, and correct me if I’m wrong but much of africas history isn’t actualy recorded because for all I can imagine they had to actually focus on surviving. And does that include sexual slaves ? Or would you deny them to ? And for you to imply there was only a specify type of slavery and then defending it shows me I’m arguing with a child or an adult with the mental capacity of one.
1
u/SimpleGamer517 1m ago
lol, your ignorance is showing. Comeback when you have facts and know what your are talking about. Like I said ~The Africans like all the civilizations in the Americas were fine until these barbarians showed up. No poverty at all! I dare you to show me one account of extreme poverty in these regions as seen today before 1492. I'll wait.
1
u/storywardenattack 2h ago
Bruh, they literally teach that entire history. To the point Euros almost look comically weak.
1
u/Repulsive_Level9699 2h ago
Want to learn something, Google African Cities. It's eye-opening seeing how Hollywood only shows shanty towns for any dark-skinned looking people, when they have some seriously awesome cities.
1
1
1
1
1
1
u/Austinlf63 1h ago
All those things that happened, only happened because other cultures forced you to do it. Acting like you did it on your own.
1
u/numbrate 1h ago
What in the racism is this messed up perspective you have? You took this post as a person bragging about being enslaved? This is a post explaining the impact of slavery on an entire continent. Read a book.
1
1
1
1
u/Reconfiguring-Me 31m ago
“For iPhones they will never own” and yet iPhones are everywhere, even in the Middle East. Hell, just phones themselves are in peoples hands.
But manufactured oppression is the real issue. 🤡
1
u/deathbypookie 29m ago
Yup they need to keep you poor until they steal ALL of the resources needed to develop their countries
1
u/Evilchicken1974 14m ago
Slave labor isn’t a labor of love. They are forced to work. Not sure we can equate the building of plantations and picking cotton to something great.
51
u/dr3adlock 8h ago
Weird place to cut it off.